This is a question to the blog clinic fast track from Kathy (not her real name) who is a tenant.
We’re renting a 1-bed house from one of the London’s agencies and there were some issues with the check in when we moved in. It wasn’t carried out to a high standard: the landlord insisted she would do it on her own (normally it’s the outside company who does this), the quality of pictures she left was extremely poor, the professional cleaning we had asked for in our offer (which she accepted) hadn’t been carried out, we weren’t told where the gas, water and electricity meters were and we had no gas, water or electricity meter readings left.
We’ll be moving out next month and we’re aware that according to the tenancy agreement we have to cover check out fees. However, we also know that the landlord was supposed to agree on check in to be done by the outside company but refused…. Bearing in mind the check in hadn’t been carried out by the outside company, I and my husband do feel it wouldn’t be fair if we paid the full cost of the check out when the check in had been completely neglected.
However, we don’t know if it’s regulated by law…. And the agency seems to be on the landlord’s side…
There were some other issues in this property but we’re not trouble makers.
I really feel they’re not treating us seriously, especially now – when we’re about to move out.The point of the check in report is for both us and the landlord to agree the state of the property and its contents before we move in. This wasn’t done and in our opinion the check out is almost pointless because there won’t be anything to compare it against to make sure you have caused any damage etc.
Can anyone help, please?
Answer
Morally I agree with you. If the landlord did not pay for a check in report, you should not have to pay for a checkout report.
It will to a certain extent depend on the terms of the tenancy agreement clause. But if the clause in itself is fair, but the landlord is expecting you to pay for a professional checkout when she did not pay for a professional check in – I’m not sure how the deposit adjudicators would treat that.
I mention the adjudicators as if you refuse to pay, the landlord may want to deduct the cost from your deposit.
I think it would be worth referring it to adjudication anyway.
However I know that adjudicators do not have the same powers to deal with things as a Judge would, and when considering the enforceability of a tenancy agreement clause of this type – whether the landlord honoured her part and paid for a professional check in may not be something they would be able to take into account when deciding whether you should be charged the cost of the checkout fee.
It would be interesting if some of the schemes could comment here and say what their view would be.
There is also the point that the landlord may not be able to succeed in any claims for deductions for damage on adjudication if she is unable to prove properly the condition of the property at checkin. However, if you did not actually do any damage – this will not help you!
If you were made aware of the fees before the tenancy why leave it until now to moan? If you were not made aware of the fee you cannot be forced to pay.
The point is that the fees should be shared fairly between landlord and tenant. If the landlord did it herself, for no charge and at low quality, it is not reasonable to expect the tenant to pay for the full service.
To put it another way, it’s equivilent to expecting an (at the commencement of the tenancy) dirty flat to be handed back spotless. The landlord has a responsibility for costs here at the commencement of the tenancy and the tenant at the end.
Whether fees are shared and how the property should be returned depend on the tenancy agreement.
Life is not fair; you are much more likely to need a reference from the landlord/agent, then the landlord needing a reference from you……
Therefore if there is a deposit dispute over something else, by all means include the checkout charge in it, but otherwise is it worth the risk of a bad reference?
What if the landlord assaults me? Do I get a bad reference if I go to the police? You’ll admit there has to be a line somewhere.
I don’t buy the whole “bad reference” thing here anyway. Normally a reference will have already been given if I’m moving out to somewhere else. I may already be insitue in my new property.
=> “What if the landlord assaults me? Do I get a bad reference if I go to the police? “
In that case you will have a copy of the police crime report to show the next landlord/agent. Likewise if you go to housing standards, you should have a copy of their
letter confirming what issues they found with the property.
=> “I don’t buy the whole “bad reference” thing here anyway. “
A lot of landlords ask a reference from the current and former landlord due to this. There is also the risk of the current landlord giving fake good references to get rid of tenants.
Re assault, you take my point though? There are some things which may not result in a police report but are still wholly unfair. Look at the ratios of upheld claims in the tenancy deposit schemes for example:
http://www.propertywire.com/news/europe/uk-tenants-landlords-disputes/ – 81% of disputes raised by agents/landlords resulted in the (full) amount in dispute.
==> A lot of landlords ask a reference from the current and former landlord due to this.
I’ve never, ever seen this. Ever. The only reference anyone has ever been interested is my current landlord and employer – and I’ve rented through quite a few big high street agents and directly from landlords in my time.
On the subject of referencing, I once got an email for a friend asking if he was a reliable person from a high street agent, because he’d not rented for a long time. I basically replied “yes” – and that was it. He got the tenancy on the back of two (university) friends saying he was reliable and – admittedly – a decent salary from a bank.
I suspect referencing is more important if you’re DSS given the dire reputation but as a professional I would not hesitate to enforce my rights, particularly after a tenancy.
Each case would, of course, be assessed on the evidence presented, however in general terms I would say that if the TA says the Tenant is liable to pay for the check out, it is likely that the adjudicator will be persuaded that they should pay the fee.
However, it does sound like the Tenant has an arguable point in respect of the different check out procedures, and they may persuade the adjudicator that the requirement for a professional check out is excessive where a Landlord “DIY” check in was completed.
The adjudicator would probably need to see that comparable check in document, in order to assess whether the Landlord is effectively using the tenancy obligations to require the Tenant to pay for a higher quality check out than they provided (and paid for) at check in, which may not be considered to be a fair obligation.